Can Infidels Be Innocents?
by Daniel Pipes
Three so-called fatwas came out in July condemning the 7/7 attacks in London.
* British Muslim Forum: "Islam strictly, strongly and severely condemns the use of violence and the destruction of innocent lives." (July 18, 2005)
* 120 Canadian Imams: "Any one who claims to be a Muslim and participates in any way in the taking of innocent life is betraying the very spirit and letter of Islam." (July 21, 2005)
* Fiqh Council Of North America: "Islam strictly condemns religious extremism and the use of violence against innocent lives." (July 28, 2005)
Non-Muslims can be forgiven if they assume these references to "innocent lives" might include those traveling on the Underground and bus lines in London. But apparently the term "innocent lives" has a much more restricted in application, as a fascinating article in The Times (London) makes clear.
Titled Undercover In The Academy Of Hatred, it is based on the covert research by Ali Hussain of the newspaper's Insight team. Ali joined the Saviour Sect in June, a few weeks before the 7/7 bombings and took along his tape recorder. What he heard is hair-raising.
"It is imperative for Muslims to instill terror into the hearts of the kuffar...I am a terrorist...as a Muslim, of course I am a terrorist...they will build tall buildings and we will bring them down...the bombings were a good start...and Allah should bless those involved" - Omar Bakri Mohammed, leader of the Saviour Sect.
He also heard two speakers discuss whom they consider to be innocent.
Zachariah, referring to the London passengers: "They're kuffar [infidels, kafirs]. They're not people who are innocent. The people who are innocent are the people who are with us or those who are living under the Islamic state."
Omar Bakri Mohammed, the sect's leader, who on July 20 publicly condemned the deaths of "innocents," but at the Selby Centre in Wood Green, north London, on July 22 referred to the 7/7 bombers as the "fantastic four" and explained that his grief for the "innocent" applied only to Muslims: "Yes I condemn killing any innocent people, but not any kuffar."
Whatever else we may glean from this article, one thing is clear. Muslim statements condemning the killing of "innocents" cannot be taken at face value but must be probed to find out who exactly are considered innocent and who not. In brief, can infidels be innocents?
Anjum Chaudri (a.k.a. Anjem Choudhury) is a follower of Omar Bakri Mohammed and UK leader of the radical al Muhajiroun, appeared on the BBC program HARDtalk where the following exchange took place with the host, Stephen Sackur:
Sackur: I just wonder why you won't condemn it when your own leader, Omar Bakri, said quite simply, "I condemn the killing of innocent people," on the 20th of July. Why won't you say what he said?
Chaudri: No, at the end of the day innocent people - when we say innocent people we mean Muslims. As far as non-Muslims are concerned, they have not accepted Islam, and as far as we are concerned, that is a crime against God.
Sackur: I want to be clear about what you are saying – this is very important – you are saying that only Muslims can count as innocent people?
Chaudri: As far as far as Muslims are concerned , you are innocent if you are a Muslim – then you are innocent in the eyes of God. If you are a non-Muslim, then you are guilty of not believing in God.
Comment: "When we say innocent people we mean Muslims." – One cannot put it more clearly or starkly than that.
In a bellicose interview in Lebanon (where he may feel he has nothing to lose in being more candid), Omar Bakri Mohammed publicly came close to confirming the above sentiments. He was questioned by Sanaa al Jack of Ash-Sharq al-Awsat:
(Q) you said that you are against killing innocent people and have nothing to do with the Al-Qaeda Organization. Now you are calling for jihad. How do you explain your position?
(A) I have often repeated that I am against the killing of innocent people anywhere in the world but who are the innocent? I keep the answer to myself
(Q) Who do you define as innocent?
(A) The innocent people are specified by Islam. I denounce killing innocent people regardless of who kills them. However, who are the innocent? I do not have to explain this issue.
(Q) Does this mean that you support killing those whom you consider guilty and those whom Islam as you understand it describes as not innocent?
(A) I support what the Sunni Muslim youths in Lebanon believe in.
(Q) What about killing in general?
(A) Sister, I do not say that I support killing in general. You said that.
(Q) But you alluded to a classification of innocent people. Does this mean that you support jihad in certain areas because of things that are being done against Islam?
(A) Do you think that the Palestinian resistance is not right?
(Q) I am not giving an opinion, I am asking about your point of view.
(A) I am against killing innocent people and I repeat this everywhere. This is my personal position.
[Devilish double-speak! These fork-tongued agents of chaos are living among us and are committed to the long term strategy of all Islamofascists everywhere...patiently waiting in silence and hiding until the time is right to strike. The fact that these loving followers of The Religion Of Peace have not been tenderly kicked out on their collective asses is a mute testimony to the weak-willed worthlessness of Western politicians. - Martel]
by Daniel Pipes
Three so-called fatwas came out in July condemning the 7/7 attacks in London.
* British Muslim Forum: "Islam strictly, strongly and severely condemns the use of violence and the destruction of innocent lives." (July 18, 2005)
* 120 Canadian Imams: "Any one who claims to be a Muslim and participates in any way in the taking of innocent life is betraying the very spirit and letter of Islam." (July 21, 2005)
* Fiqh Council Of North America: "Islam strictly condemns religious extremism and the use of violence against innocent lives." (July 28, 2005)
Non-Muslims can be forgiven if they assume these references to "innocent lives" might include those traveling on the Underground and bus lines in London. But apparently the term "innocent lives" has a much more restricted in application, as a fascinating article in The Times (London) makes clear.
Titled Undercover In The Academy Of Hatred, it is based on the covert research by Ali Hussain of the newspaper's Insight team. Ali joined the Saviour Sect in June, a few weeks before the 7/7 bombings and took along his tape recorder. What he heard is hair-raising.
"It is imperative for Muslims to instill terror into the hearts of the kuffar...I am a terrorist...as a Muslim, of course I am a terrorist...they will build tall buildings and we will bring them down...the bombings were a good start...and Allah should bless those involved" - Omar Bakri Mohammed, leader of the Saviour Sect.
He also heard two speakers discuss whom they consider to be innocent.
Zachariah, referring to the London passengers: "They're kuffar [infidels, kafirs]. They're not people who are innocent. The people who are innocent are the people who are with us or those who are living under the Islamic state."
Omar Bakri Mohammed, the sect's leader, who on July 20 publicly condemned the deaths of "innocents," but at the Selby Centre in Wood Green, north London, on July 22 referred to the 7/7 bombers as the "fantastic four" and explained that his grief for the "innocent" applied only to Muslims: "Yes I condemn killing any innocent people, but not any kuffar."
Whatever else we may glean from this article, one thing is clear. Muslim statements condemning the killing of "innocents" cannot be taken at face value but must be probed to find out who exactly are considered innocent and who not. In brief, can infidels be innocents?
Anjum Chaudri (a.k.a. Anjem Choudhury) is a follower of Omar Bakri Mohammed and UK leader of the radical al Muhajiroun, appeared on the BBC program HARDtalk where the following exchange took place with the host, Stephen Sackur:
Sackur: I just wonder why you won't condemn it when your own leader, Omar Bakri, said quite simply, "I condemn the killing of innocent people," on the 20th of July. Why won't you say what he said?
Chaudri: No, at the end of the day innocent people - when we say innocent people we mean Muslims. As far as non-Muslims are concerned, they have not accepted Islam, and as far as we are concerned, that is a crime against God.
Sackur: I want to be clear about what you are saying – this is very important – you are saying that only Muslims can count as innocent people?
Chaudri: As far as far as Muslims are concerned , you are innocent if you are a Muslim – then you are innocent in the eyes of God. If you are a non-Muslim, then you are guilty of not believing in God.
Comment: "When we say innocent people we mean Muslims." – One cannot put it more clearly or starkly than that.
In a bellicose interview in Lebanon (where he may feel he has nothing to lose in being more candid), Omar Bakri Mohammed publicly came close to confirming the above sentiments. He was questioned by Sanaa al Jack of Ash-Sharq al-Awsat:
(Q) you said that you are against killing innocent people and have nothing to do with the Al-Qaeda Organization. Now you are calling for jihad. How do you explain your position?
(A) I have often repeated that I am against the killing of innocent people anywhere in the world but who are the innocent? I keep the answer to myself
(Q) Who do you define as innocent?
(A) The innocent people are specified by Islam. I denounce killing innocent people regardless of who kills them. However, who are the innocent? I do not have to explain this issue.
(Q) Does this mean that you support killing those whom you consider guilty and those whom Islam as you understand it describes as not innocent?
(A) I support what the Sunni Muslim youths in Lebanon believe in.
(Q) What about killing in general?
(A) Sister, I do not say that I support killing in general. You said that.
(Q) But you alluded to a classification of innocent people. Does this mean that you support jihad in certain areas because of things that are being done against Islam?
(A) Do you think that the Palestinian resistance is not right?
(Q) I am not giving an opinion, I am asking about your point of view.
(A) I am against killing innocent people and I repeat this everywhere. This is my personal position.
[Devilish double-speak! These fork-tongued agents of chaos are living among us and are committed to the long term strategy of all Islamofascists everywhere...patiently waiting in silence and hiding until the time is right to strike. The fact that these loving followers of The Religion Of Peace have not been tenderly kicked out on their collective asses is a mute testimony to the weak-willed worthlessness of Western politicians. - Martel]
